Do kiters eat their young too?

UnusuallyLargeRobin · Post by **UnusuallyLargeRobin** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 7:31 pm

Got your attention? Good. I have a minor rant from the June 19 weekend that I've finally cooled down enough from to post on this forum. On Saturday, this scenario happened, a kiter (dale) came floating on down through the windsurf beach and and finally got his kite onto land. He had abandoned his board which was way out in the middle and heading way down wind towards the end of the lake. So he strips off his rash guard and jumps in for the marathon swim to recover his board. No wetsuit, no floatation, nothing. Not very smart to be sure. My issue is this, I proceed to run up to Kiteville to solicit help from anyone to rescue him, ideally the ski or the mini-zodiac. To a person everyone I encountered had this to say about a fellow kiter who could have easily been in serious, life threatening trouble... "serves him right", "don't know him", "oh well, maybe he'll learn next time"...on and on. I'm talking about a lot of people I tried to get involved. No one said "I'll go help him". What is with you people, sure he's an ass for trying to swim it, but regardless, shit happens and people get in trouble. That is when you step up and try and help. No one would give me any help or assistance, didn't want to bother, blah blah blah... Finally the mini-zodiac guy appeared and he went and helped out. Kudos to him- but thumbs down to rest of you. Real nice attitude you've got going on up there. Better hope there's some people who care when it's you taking your last breath! Wake up! You all will have chances to redeem yourselves. Robin Mitchell

~ pimp hand ~ · Post by **~ pimp hand ~** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 8:19 pm

my guess is kiters just havn't developed the same commrodery yet that windsurfers have ... also windsurfers are more like real vessells/boats, the ability to sail out and drag the person back to shore easier, and probably tend to abid by the unwritten 'law of the sea' to help another vessell in distress

that's my 2 cents

bwd · Post by **bwd** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 8:42 pm

~ pimp hand ~ wrote:my guess is kiters just havn't developed the same commrodery yet that windsurfers have ...

Actually, I think it's the opposite. Lately I've been hanging around kiter friends (

) and I'm envious of how close a group they are. Maybe it's because they rely on each other to launch and land? Not sure, but it sure seems like a close community to me. I can't comment on Robin's story tho,

dave

mshepard · Post by **mshepard** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 11:43 pm

Robin, sounds like an unfortunate incident all right. I have been going up to the lake since 1987 and have to say that I have had nothing but positive experiences with kiters, hikers, windsurfers, kayakers, sailors swimmers, mainlanders, locals etc. etc.

windaddiction · Post by **windaddiction** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 6:46 am

a little question here i think i may have seen him float by and i saw his board and I was going to go grab it but that would have put me a little too close for comfort to those lines! what is the thing to do in a situation like this?, is it a case of one man one board or should you help and risk you're stuff or what!

grant · Post by **grant** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 8:12 am

ahhh, I hate getting involved in this stuff, but this just seems so wrong, here goes: Yep Robin, that sucks. Anyone who was there and saw somebody who may have needed help, and didn't offer, is a bonehead. We need to get way over this idea that there are two separate groups of water/wind users , that is kiters and windsurfers, and that they don't mix. Everyone there has a responsibility to help out if there's the need.
( Let's not forget the question too, that perhaps Dale enjoyed his swim, and has no idea that he caused an incident. Did anybody talk to him after to see if he was worried or not?)
But what really pisses me off here is that you did the right thing and asked for help from the kite community and didn't get it. That's shocking. All of my time as a kiter, I've been amazed at how helpful the group is. People have run miles, unasked, to catch my kite, and I like to think I've done the same. I really don't want to let this story be the turning point on the good vibe the kite scene has had. But for sure, it bugs me. I haven't spent much time at the lake this year, but I've heard stories of 30, 40, 50 kites, and not too many friendly faces. What's up with the bad attitudes? I thought the learning process of kiting also taught co-operation.
So I suppose there will be selfish, ignorant, asshole kiteboarders, in just about the same proportion as any other piece of the population. Nothing we can do about that. But thanks for helping out Robin, and next time you need to ask for help, odds are you'll get it.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 9:02 am

[smilie=rauch28.gif] .oh the carnage""

Why?
Everyone should just get along with each other.
Our community is only so big.
Toughen up every one!!

MEAN PEOPLE SUCK · Post by **MEAN PEOPLE SUCK** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 9:03 am

I am truly NOT Sorry to say this..... but in my experience MANY people who visit from other places (i.e.Vancouver) have a terrible city attitude that they bring not only to the water...but in the campground tooo...i.e. you can't camp here i am saving it .........or get out of my water space...and then try to run you off the water......or you touched my gear i'm gonna kick your ass....... i have even noticed that some of this ignorant attitude is rubbing off on our local riders....too bad......some who used to help.....are not helping out now......its not that i am trying to cause trouble....but i am just acting on what i see......great job to all those who look after others....oh yes there are some really nice people who visit tooo...oh ya....nitinat is not a competition....take your useless attitudes somewhere else.........[/u]

Topher · Post by **Topher** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 10:12 am

First of all dont blame the attitude on a CITY!!!Nothing pisses me off more than some group thinking they are better than others because of where they come from - this includes islanders. Although I strongly believe the majority of the people who live on the west coast are great, hospitable, mature, and dedicated people. The downside to kiting is it is a bit of a show off sport, people airing only close to others, and infront of the beach. Once again a huge frustration of mine, I'd much rather head way up wind with a few friends and muck around with them on the other side. But show offs aside, since getting into the sport I have been truely amazed at the support the community offers. Maybe its my close nit group who I ride with, but most other people are helpful with retreiving boards(which can save hours of cold swimming), offer a pull into the beach with a torn kite, offer help and advice relaunching etc. Unfortunately there is always others who are not helpful, I could attribute this to the younger crowd getting into kiting, and they have not had the life experience to be mature and responsible for all kiters/windsurfer's safety on the water. As for grumpy campers, it is always the unfortunate case of a paradise place like Nitnat. As the saying goes - ONCE YOU CALL IT PARADISE, IT'S ONLY DOWN HILL WITH CROWDS AND ATTITUDES AFTER THAT. I still do my best to spread the good vibes and preserve the magic that the island, and Nitnat have to offer. Take care all and Ill see you and hopefully meet some of you in person up at the Lake over the long weekend - come say hi and sail upwind with me - 2 green airush kites, litewave board, prolimit wetsuit and always having fun!!! CHEERS - Whew what an essay

Topher · Post by **Topher** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 10:22 am

One more thing I always get nervous about - and it is getting much worse!! KITERS be safe! Give each othere lots of room on the water, lower your kites for the right of way, dont, I repeat DO NOT pinch people off near the beach. Don't lauch unless you have checked your lines, and dont say 'yes I ll launch you' if you have no idea what you are doing - you are taking on responsibility for the kiter!!! Saftey first - fun second....it is a deadly sport so know what you are doing before you head out. L8R

Kook St. Kite Kook · Post by **Kook St. Kite Kook** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 12:30 pm

Robin: What you experienced is extremely unfortunate, and unusual. I have seen nothing but extreme cooperation and a strong sense of community from other kiters.

I know that generalizations don't help, but it is a simple fact that big city dwellers usually have a stonger sense of individual responsibility, and those from smaller cities/towns are often filled with a stronger sense of community. This weekend there were more big city dwellers than usual.

But I absolutely agree, Topher, that you can't blame a city (My entire family is from Vancouver, and I think it is ridiculous to judge someone based on their resisdence). I only offer that up as a possible partial explanation.

Similarly, the Bystander Effect is a well known phenomenon, named after the Kitty Genovese murder where 38 witnesses did nothing to help (http://www.crimelibrary.com/serial_kill ... _genovese/).

Simply put, when you have a large number of people, there is a diffusion of responsibility among those present. City dwellers have proven to be more supseptable to the phenomenon.

I also think Grant makes a good point, in that many people consider a swim across the lake a pleasant experiece (but crazy, imo, if there are windusers going back and forth...). Although I always prefer a tow in (and have been offered many times), some people do prefer to swim.

So, please do not cast aspersions on the kiter community. I personally have been blown away by the strong community demonstrated by kiters, and pleasantly surprised by the merger of windsurfer/kiters who use Dallas rd. and Gordon's. In my opinion, this website has the potential to bring us all closer together (and in some ways has done so already), and I think it would be unfortunate if this forum moved us in the opposite direction.

Cheers,

Paul

local Naish guy · Post by **local Naish guy** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 3:14 pm

I have been involved with the local sailing community for over 20 years,and this is the first time that I have heard this kind of responce to a sailer in trouble.Here on the Island we have a close knit community,everyone seems willing to help whenever needed.We all need help sooner or later.No matter how skilled a sailer we are "Shit happens"!And we should do our best to help.I really don't think the larger city dwellers think any different.Granted,there is always going to be those who don't want to get involved.Those people need to realize that somewhere like NITNAT has a history of involvement with the sailing community.If you go there to play,expect to get called on,to help in whatever way is nessessary.You don't just go there to USE the place.If there is an EMERGANCY,expect to be asked to help.In what ever way you can.We have fought fires so save the site,e-vac injured party's,pooled resources to help stranded campers,you name it! The more people that use the site,The more situations are going to come up,where people are going to need help.Maybe,just don't go to NITNAT if you are not prepared to help the community.After all,When you are away from home, the campsite becomes everyones home for a time.Lets try to help more,take away all your garbage,even some that isn't yours.Respect the place as the wonderfull site that it is ,and the people that use it.Respect and help your fellow campers.May your wind be sweet,and your bed be soft.

Ross · Post by **Ross** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 3:21 pm

Ahh, I remember the good old days but lets not give up on things. We can only lead by example. Help anyone regardless of who they are, introduce yourself to those you don`t know( friendly groups of people can be intimidating to those on the outside).And remember good deeds don`t need to be reciprocated. Oh and if you apply this to the rest of your life , not just kiting, you`ll sleep well.

JL · Post by JL » Fri Jun 25, 2004 3:57 pm

I spent last weekend @ Nitinat with my son & his friend...First trip in 2 years. It was very crowded but we had a good time. Sorry Russian guy, Dave & Bobson for being such an early riser! I found the on the water scene to be just like I remembered...All kinds, just like on the high way! I just find my own space, be it water or shore and try to hang out with like minded people. If a scene seems awkward just move on..I work with the public & have zero tollerance trying to rationalize with impaired people...P.S. anyone new to Nitinat remember it is a tidal lake...Leave your gear ABOVE the high water mark before leaving the beach for the night!!!

more force 4 · Post by **more force 4** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 4:10 pm

I was there just on the Sunday, and passed two windsurfers in a raft (like of sea otters?

) rolling up equipment. I went upwind, gybed, back to the beach, and started asking about who's jet ski it was, because someone might need help. Everyone I asked tried to help me find the right people, and I found the jetski driver at the same time as did the guy who had been helping on the water, who had come in. The North Shore ? jetski dude didn't hesitate, but ran down to the machine and powered off down the lake, returning with the sailor, towing his board, with a sail and broken mast wrapped up. He then returned to do a half dozen rescues of windsurfers and kiters that were past the village in the 30 kt wind. Kudos, the driver must have lost a lot of kiting time with his various rescues. I never thought I'd appreciate having a jet ski around - it was great! I never saw any negative attitudes from either kiters or windsurfers, lets keep it that way (but I did notice more garbage than ever before

!!)
Morley

Do kiters eat their young too?

Do kiters eat their young too?

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