How we use the University of Washington Wind Model

Russian Dood · Post by **Russian Dood** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 10:58 pm

"Predicted winds" table on the site is updated twice a day, so Dave doesn't load UW too much, when you check "Wind model" the browser gets pretty pictures directly from UW ( via IFRAME for those who's interested ), so from UW's stand point of view they have lots of fans and weather enthusiasts checking their data.

more force 4 · Post by **more force 4** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 10:46 am

So if BWD only loads data directly a couple of times a day, I'm astonished that UW would consider this 'overuse'!

GregK · Post by **GregK** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 10:58 pm

I agree with others, the Predicted Winds table is the best part of this awesome site. I hope it's not lost. I'm a 3 times per day user.

This site embodies the original intent of the internet : to share information for the benefit of all. Pure benevolence, zippo commercialism. Probably mirrors U of W's intent in posting MM5 output. I don't understand why the U of W would find BWD's useage excessive, I would call it "successive" !

Gdawg · Post by **Gdawg** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 8:48 am

Hugely useful. 3x / day user.

bwd · Post by **bwd** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 5:03 pm

Thanks for taking the time to respond everyone. I was really hoping to get more responses, considering the 1000 or so users that use the site everyday.

Just to be clear. The model does update 2x/day but all of the results do not come in at once. Please read this for more info: http://www.bigwavedave.ca/forecasts.php?page=7

The 12km model results come in first and then the 4km (9-12 am/pm). Each hour of the model takes time to finish so the results some in gradually over 3-4 hours (9am-12pm and 9pm-12am or so). That is why I have to continually access the UofW pages to check for new data.

I just called Puget Sound Clean Air Agency which apparently works with UofW on the WRF model. They are cracking down on heavy users of their data. Apparently BWD.ca is at the top of the list for usage, both from my home computer and from links on the forecast page. This means we are heavier users then any gov't agency in the US. I guess we should be proud, but unfortunately this is serious:
http://www.atmos.washington.edu/mm5rt/w ... ml#TOPREFS

They want to make sure we are non-profit and they are asking for some kind of donation ($1000/month a real possibility). The problem is that they do not have any sort of mandate to make this data public so it is possible that we could lose access. They rely on donations to keep this service running. They are reading this so please contribute to this topic if you use the model tables.

Thanks
Dave

duckbill · Post by **duckbill** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 6:59 pm

Dave, free access to this awesome site, with only sporadic donations and the odd fundraiser? This is definitely a non-profit site. I would hate to see you add a layer of administration to collect monthly or yearly fees from the users because I think you put enough time into the site and its maintenance. Thank you.

G-Daddy · Post by **G-Daddy** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 8:16 pm

Once a day for me. Keep it up Dave. I'm pretty sure you're a 'non-profit' organization....

Sandy Beach · Post by **Sandy Beach** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 9:38 pm

like BA and Jelly...once, twice, three times a lady.

thankgodiatepastafobreaky · Thu Oct 29, 2009 10:25 pm

hey Dave - I've been with you since the start and it is very apparent that your motivation for running this site is purely for the love of wind sports, and forecasting, and providing information for the wind-loving community. Hope it all works out and all of us athletes get to continue to enjoy the benefits of your hard work including the brilliant table you designed using the U of Washington's data. It is only information and if it is cut off it doesn't benefit anyone?? I don't understand why they have a problem with the usage? I'm sure the bandwidth is minimal in terms of an actual dollar cost. This is the nature of the internet - frictionless information flow for the benefit of everyone. They should be proud such a benevolent healthy eco-friendly community is using it and they are assisting. Thank you U OF W. We visit your communities when going south and spend lots of money!

nanmoo · Post by **nanmoo** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 12:01 pm

May I suggest putting a blatantly obviously banner on the front of the site temporarily, advising users of the situation and how they can help. Alhough 1000+ users visit the site daily, I imagine they may not read the forums or posts and know about this issue. Perhaps it could be a page with a link to add input that loads before you can access the BWD homepage.

Just an idea.

Sculp · Post by **Sculp** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 1:08 pm

I agree with Mr Nanmoo.... 45 responses is sad. Folks must be unaware of this.
Gord.

Geoffy · Post by **Geoffy** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 1:28 pm

I am a regular user (not daily unless and until some wind shows up then several times a day). Way more important than my limited use ---

The SISKA (South Island Sea Kayak Association) and several other sea kayak clubs in and around Vancouver Island, US San Juan Islands, and many sea kayak guides use the service regularly to determine locations to paddle from, where and when to plan trips, and what conditions to expect. Unfortunately they are "quiet" users of the site. I was on the phone less than an hour ago and learned they were using this site to determine which is the safe venue to paddle from for a SISKA-organized club-wide trip tomorrow.

I have talked to several folks while windsurfing in Oregon who use the site for their coastal area forecast review, in conjunction with NOAA and other data.

I use it to pre-determine when the trips to Oregon Coast should be taken (3 last Summer).

The site is definitely non-profit, likely has cost Dave a pretty penny in funds in and lost wages over the years, and I know our contributions only go to offset some hardware costs for weather stations and webcams.

Great thanks to UofW for access/use of their data, please allow this to continue.
Geoff

KUS · Post by **KUS** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 1:38 pm

1) this site is non-profit, make no mistake about that,
2) in fact it is not just windjunkies that use this site but sometimes i think they are the minority when compared to fishermen, kayakers, tourists, pleasure boaters and other water users which benefit from the safety aspects of the updated forecasts.....hundreds if not thousands of them. You will NOT get these folks to acknowledge themselves and they don't care enough to worry about continuity.

Sooo, it begs the question: if you created the data to benefit others (and this is super and much appreciated but....) what more do you want?

If you don't want anyone to see or use it, perhaps you should block it. (we would really be saddened)

If it costs money to provide it, i suppose you will need to decide whether to continue it. There is not much opportunity for user fees in my mind

most certainly dreaming at $1000/month. (sorry, we are not much help there)

If we are not understanding the issue correctly, forgive us as most of us are computer (& model & internet) inept.

However: To focus on this site that channels the benefits to so many hardly seems fair nor sensible.
Please pretty please continue our access if at all possible. Thank you

downwind dave · Post by **downwind dave** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 2:43 pm

i like the model and find it quite useful. i probably hit it up twice a day through the winter, not so much in the summer. i would just access it directly if it wasnt up at bwd.ca, making more hits for them which seems like the opposite of what they want if i understand this issue correctly. The bigDave table is just much easier to understand at a glance then their little map with the coloured arrows.

Gramma Jo · Post by **Gramma Jo** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 2:50 pm

Hi -- I'm still out here watching from the sidelines. I use the wind data about once a week, and for those uses would be quite lost without it. For instance we took a friend to Vancouver this week. She suffers from travel ills. We had to pick the best, most calm day on the water. BWD.ca provided that valuable information in the wind data. Non-profit organizations that are not registered as such run into this kind of problem. Registering would be time consuming, difficult and expensive. However, just read the various posts over time, and it's quite clear that there's no profit being made here. Keep up the good work Dave! I hope more of us limited users step forward too to have their voices heard. I would definitely miss this wind data service if it was discontinued. Gramma Jo

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