Olympic sailing class considerations

KayakDoc · Post by **KayakDoc** » Mon Sep 03, 2012 12:21 pm

Kus, Even though getting you to change your mind might be as difficult as learning how to tack a kite race board at high speed, give us a little time. Kite Board Racing is gonna get a big shove from the America’s Cup effort and like their transformation from 12M through the “tiny” test boats http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jvk4D-Gl ... ure=relmfu and on to the “Big Boys” (notice the rudders and foils on these beasts) http://www.americascup.com/en/news/3/ne ... ncisco-bay watching Kite Board Racing will hopefully improve to “filling status” or maybe even the fun of a “cleaning and checkup”.

KUS · Post by **KUS** » Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:55 pm

thankgodiatepastafobreaky · Tue Sep 04, 2012 10:18 am

in regards to the wide range of weights all competing together:

http://www.internationalkiteboarding.or ... arison.pdf

but all the board makers going to the max width of 70 cm after paint, wouldn't it make sense to make a light person version of the gear just simply scaling the board size/ fin size down with the exact same dims? I am only about 70 kg and still think I'm going really fast on my surfboard and very comfortable and in control compared to having to handle an ankle breaking formula car attached to my feet. There must be an in between for lighter riders???

KayakDoc · Post by **KayakDoc** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 12:43 pm

Hey Pasta, As we are still in the initial rounds of race board design, questions of rider size vs. board size are still a ways off. At this point it seems the equation is “How much kite and fin can I hold down on the “fastest/yet controllable” board I can get my hands on”.

The current spat of board designers (and to a lesser degree the fin designers) are trying to find the fastest controllable design for most conditions and by controllable I mean fast downwind, but also with maximum upwind reach. (The present race boards are not the best upwind boards. The quads were better upwind, but the quads were not controllable running balls out downwind).

Your surfboard may be faster than a race board in some downwind conditions, but I doubt it will get close to upwind reach compared to the present race board designs. So your surfboard would have to be very, very fast to make up enough time to compensate for lack of upwind capability. You could of course widen your surf board, reduce the rocker and add three honking big fins...wait...that’s a race board.

I think your question regarding best board design for a rider of a given weight will be addressed once the initial questions of “best” all around board performance have been answered. Until then the only solution is to begin designing and building your own race boards (which I know you can do).

I shaped my latest race board yesterday.

...and remember, the first Porsche was a tractor.

JL · Post by JL » Tue Sep 04, 2012 2:51 pm

I think your thinking of Ferruccio Lamborghini. He was having clutch problems with his Ferrari & Enzo wouldn't listen to complaints from a mere tractor manufacturer so he began producing sports cars. http://www.lamboweb.com/History.htm

KayakDoc · Post by **KayakDoc** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 3:05 pm

Good story JL, but Porsche’s first vehicle was, I believe, a tractor.

“Professor Porsche had a longtime interest in farming equipment. One of his early passions, at a time when agriculture consumed a large portion of most European lives, was to build a farm tractor to replace horses and oxen. His first tractor endeavor was in 1914 when he used his newly developed “Power House” military tractor to plow the fields at Austro-Daimler. After the formation of the first Porsche company in Stuttgart the earliest opportunity to develop a Porsche tractor project, Type 110, came in 1937”.

JL · Post by JL » Tue Sep 04, 2012 3:21 pm

O.K. enough auto history

Back to kite racing. How about Greg's idea of retractable fins? Maybe fixed thrusters & an adjustable center fin (s) http://www.smartfins.com/Technology.html

thankgodiatepastafobreaky · Tue Sep 04, 2012 3:57 pm

my last few days out I was in the 2 outside straps on the downwind legs as well so you ride the fins downwind and so they are actually lifting the board out, just like windsurfing. so I think the fins are the key to speed. i just think that the board size/weight could still come down, but maintained just enough to be floaty for lighter wind races and wide enough to accommodate the side fins.??

KayakDoc · Post by **KayakDoc** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 4:13 pm

Jl; Checkout the picture at the bottom of this article. http://www.internationalkiteboarding.or ... Itemid=140 Twin tip kick-ups might be the future.

thankgodiatepastafobreaky · Thu Sep 06, 2012 12:26 am

interesting that you need to have a million liability insurance to kite-race in the worlds. it's only $49 but necessary.

http://www.internationalkiteboarding.or ... le&id=4867

i wonder if this is required in other races as well?

thankgodiatepastafobreaky · Sun Sep 09, 2012 6:47 pm

...with regard to the light wind 6 knot min race rule. I was sailing around with Mark at Nitinat in about 8 knots, I on the raceboard and an 11 M Race kite, and Mark was on a 16 M Crossbow and a racboard. We both blew a tack, kites down and couldn't relaunch. But up to that point we were fine and flying. So the 6 knot min makes sense to weed out those who can't complete these tacks. At any point if you end up still in the water at this windspeed the kite hindenbergs and it's all over. No more apparent wind. And I don't think having a 17M or bigger would help unless you can fly the kite in that windspeed while still in the water. Racebar custom-build is working well - thanks JL!

KayakDoc · Post by **KayakDoc** » Sun Sep 09, 2012 8:24 pm

Pasta, That is the rule for super light wind...NEVER STOP MOVING AND DON’T FALL IN. So let’s see some pics of your custom race bar. Saw the latest Rista super carbon fins yesterday. I believe they are carbon G10. Really fancy...black with gold lettering.

thankgodiatepastafobreaky · Sun Sep 09, 2012 8:51 pm

here are 2 photos that mosaic together (if you really strain your brain )

after the first sail I ditched the mini-fifth and have to move the clam cleat further from the bar since it acted as a stopper in quickly overpowered gusts where i wasn't yet quick enough with the new trim technique.

i just wish there was a way to set it up so that pulling the trim was more like a sailboat mainsheet and it powered you up instead of depowered you.

KayakDoc · Post by **KayakDoc** » Sun Sep 09, 2012 9:01 pm

Hey Pasta, It looks very good. Same as my Ozone production race bar, although you seem to have a massive amount of depower (I have a stopper knot half way up the sheeting line). As far as wishing “there was a way to set it up so that pulling the trim was more like a sailboat mainsheet and it powered you up instead of depowered you”. Uh yah...isn’t that like...let me see....windsurfing?

mark atkins · Post by **mark atkins** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 12:04 pm

Thanks for all the assistance & advice Greg!
Also a big thanks to Marty for the jet ski assist when it got too light to relaunch...
Friday was really fun, but wow what a learning curve!
High Speed downwind runs on the race boards is reminiscent of my formula days, albeit a bit scarier.
Greg, if you are down for some training in the coming weeks, let me know.
?LW Gordos or LW IV might be good options location wise...
best,
M.

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